Tanuj: when are you getting iPhone
Tanuj: Pranav got one
Vikas: no iPhone it s very inefficient device
Vikas: it s lie burning your hard earned money
Tanuj: don't tell that to Pranav
Tanuj: he is a big fan
Vikas: i mean there is surely a hype and brand of apple products
Vikas: but if you want to talk analytically, it s very easy to prove that it s very inefficient, both feature wise and money wise.
Vikas: e.g it will have 100 features which they show in ads etc.. and create all the hype
Vikas: but once u have the phone all you "need" is 2 feature
Vikas: need is a keyword here
Vikas: of course u can force your lifestyle to read email in toilet" but that s making life more complicated and inefficient, I would say.
Tanuj: well, that’s true for your Bluetooth phone also
Vikas: ok, someone wants a debate here.
Vikas: let see.
Vikas: did u read all my messages.
Vikas: in last 3 min;
Tanuj: yes i did
Vikas: ok
Vikas: so no rephrase your point of my BT phone set
Tanuj: bluetooth is also added convenience rather than need...isn't it ?
Vikas: ok
Vikas: got it
Vikas: "Added convenience"
Vikas: don’t say antying till I say OVER.
Tanuj: ok
Vikas: when wheel was invented, it was an "added convenience".
Vikas: but it instead of adding complication in life, it in fact simplified your life.
Vikas: so the way i look at it:
Vikas: whether the new feature is simplifying something that i already do/face in my lifestyle
Vikas: or if it is just adding a convenience in my life which is not required.
Vikas: e.g who can justify reading email on iPhone in toilet?
Vikas: unless you are CEO of a company or President etc.
Vikas: 99.99999% are not.,
Vikas: OVER
Tanuj: I am no salesman for iPhone, but this is what the iPhone customers will say -
Tanuj: toilet email is not the only thing..we use iPhone and use it a lot..e.g. navigation feature, fast internet on the go, indispensable for travel for entertainment, communication, information etc...not as a need but as simplifying smth you already do
Tanuj: and not to forget variety of apps that keeps you involved for better or worse
Tanuj: of course it costs money but if I can afford it I don't mind owning it
Tanuj: OVER
Vikas: 1. navigation feature: in my exp i am yet to see a car driving with a phone tilted and hooked in car dash. inf act anyone who buys a 30,000 car, will immediately buy a $200 dedicated in-car-staying gps device
Vikas: what i have found instead is that in very big metros (bigger than MSP maybe) where ppl have veyr big downtowns and 1000 restaurants to pick from.. there they find mobile phone based navigation useful. them using it, i can see the logic as no one takes the GPS out of car when you go out walking n downtown, but now how big is that class. i doubt it if it is big enough.
Vikas: for 90% people, really, they can force themselves to use it as a navigation device, but then they better not buy another device for their car, coz the moment they do it, it will make their iPhone inefficient.
Vikas: 2. fast internet on the go. it has two parts, "fast" and "on the go"
Vikas: "fast" is just an eyewash, and no intelligent person should use it in argument.
Vikas: unless you really have data to back it up and prove it that the fastness is significant.
Vikas: "on the go" ...how much time of one’s day a person is "on the go"
Vikas: out of that how much time he or she is not driving
Vikas: and out of that how much time he or she really need internet.
Vikas: what left after these many "out of thats" will be extremely extremely small.
Vikas: 3. indispensible for travel for entertainment.. here all they are doing is using it as mp3 player.. which all of their past phones and existing phone can do without costing them a dime.
Vikas: a little percentage might classify entertainment while travel as reading news or info while traveling in subway.. i wud say that is no better than having a nice conversation with your co passenger in subway.. you will be more social and happy
Vikas: 4. communication::
Vikas: talk or email
Vikas: talk is the only feature which is really why phones are there so no argument on that front.
Vikas: email, now again, you have to be really really busy person like CEO etc to read and write your email via phone. writing email on phone is not easy and PC are so ubiquitous
Vikas: so all these features..they have 10% "Simplification of existing things" and 90% of "complication via new things"
Vikas: OVER
Tanuj: wow!
Tanuj: a much longer debate could ensue if you were talking to an iPhone fan, but I will briefly say this
Tanuj: suppose you have a all in one device...may not be the best in each of its features, but good enough, and suppose you get it for very cheap..most people would like to have it..
Tanuj: the question of money is purely economical. right now it is expensive because it caters only to those who think they can afford it and probably because it has no other real competitor in its class
Tanuj: sooner or later it will be cheap or other cheaper devices will be in the market
Tanuj: rest of the points are quite subjective and varies with personal point of view
Tanuj: I know at least 3 graduate students who own it and swear by it despite paying heavy bucks for it..that says smth, personally i wouldn't be getting it during my graduate studies at least
Tanuj: OVER
Vikas: i will go in reverse order this time.
Vikas: 1. who owns it and swears by it after paying heavy money...
Vikas: they can afford it. its their earned money. freedom of expression and choice.people derive happiness through various artifacts. these artifacts re function of their background, the way the look at ads, the amount of thinking they do in whatever angle they bring into the analysis etc.
Vikas: it says "smth" but that smth is about them and not about the device or artifact.
Vikas: 2. subjectivity.
Vikas: logic is absolute not subjective to ppl's perception
Vikas: all the points i made, which you said could be subjective, were kind of examples to what i said earlier that:
Vikas: A. whether the new feature is simplifying something that i already do/face in my lifestyle
B. or if it is just adding a convenience in my life which is not required.
Vikas: A and B can be argued.
Vikas: 3. sooner or later they will become cheap
Vikas: and also obsolete.. moreover the primary market of these phones do not buy these now-cheaper phones.. so even if they become cheap, it s not affecting its map on the face of America. it s not helping ppl have a cheaper device.
Vikas: when these device become cheaper they become cheaper becoz they get replaced by other new expensive devices..
Vikas: so if u consider "Active" device as any device which ppl are really buying..it will always come from "expensive" class rather than
Vikas: "now-cheaper" class.
Vikas: so practically speaking, they are always expensive.
Vikas: 4. no real competitor..
Vikas: now who wants to make a phone with 100 features when they know ony 2-5 is what caters to 95% ppl
Vikas: there is no market to compete
Vikas: if i m a businessman i wud like to make a phone with 7 features which caters to 95% ppl. and happily choose not to compete with iPhone.
Vikas: OVER
Tanuj: ok, well you have a point. However, those who use it think it is smth that simplifies they need to do. Could be a false perception, i don't know.
Tanuj: when wheels were invented, let’s say cars, it was affordable to only a few and it was'nt a real need then, only after the technology matured and mass produced, everyone starts using it, same is with GPS, many do without it those who afford make their lives simpler by paying for it. I understand your point to this view so you need not reiterate, the discussion's already quite long
Vikas: car was a real need, it was just prohibitively expensive.
Tanuj: transport is always a need
Tanuj: ultimate transporter is the fictitious teleporter that should replace all transportation
Tanuj: ppl. pay for Mercedes when they can do with corolla
Vikas: that was what i said in " 1. who owns it and swears by it after paying heavy money... "
Vikas: it says about ppl and not about merc or Toyota.
Tanuj: right, exactly your point
Tanuj: if you have money to spare let the leechers have it
Vikas: fine with me
Vikas: my only point is when ppl say they want iPhone or merc, they don’t say this point : "if you have money to spare let the leechers have it"
Tanuj: long debate..post it somewhere for public to see
Vikas:
Vikas: sure shud be archived
Vikas: for the guilty pleasures of iPhone owners
Tanuj: would you mind if I let iPhone users read this ?
Vikas: i dont mind at all.
Tanuj: lets see if some smeltering rocks fall onto KC
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